Comments on: Barricade and history / Notes on the intensification of bourgeois antagonism http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/ Irregular updates and articles on the situation in Greece, in English Thu, 11 Mar 2010 10:51:03 +0000 http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2 hourly 1 By: pixilated http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-995 pixilated Mon, 29 Dec 2008 11:19:25 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-995 Every anarchist group has their own way of communicating too I think. Some collectives I know explain things in terms of witch magic and wizardry. It can get kind of confusing to people at first, because you're not sure what parts are REAL and which parts FALSE, ex.g. is this the limit of your imagination or is this really possible? But that's their point - insurrection is so fucking possible. And once you get the idea, it all starts to make sense, not to mention it's funny because anarchists are witches and wizards. The people who are reactionaries are referred to as muggles like in, yes, Harry Potter books. So kids like to read it too. Every anarchist group has their own way of communicating too I think. Some collectives I know explain things in terms of witch magic and wizardry. It can get kind of confusing to people at first, because you’re not sure what parts are REAL and which parts FALSE, ex.g. is this the limit of your imagination or is this really possible? But that’s their point – insurrection is so fucking possible. And once you get the idea, it all starts to make sense, not to mention it’s funny because anarchists are witches and wizards. The people who are reactionaries are referred to as muggles like in, yes, Harry Potter books. So kids like to read it too.

]]> By: pixilated http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-994 pixilated Mon, 29 Dec 2008 11:11:23 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-994 Medusa, I think we (the non-Greeks, but I understand you are Greek) should be learning from what the Greeks are and have been doing, because obviously, whatever it is works. So in my view if they produce dense texts it's probably a reflection of their own dense work and revolutionary organizing. Elsewhere, maybe what the "general public" would be more receptive to is how we actually talk or communicate ideas to each other. I personally feel more invited into something when I join an ongoing conversation as opposed to when I'm being talked down to. And I also really appreciate their style of writing communiques. Medusa, I think we (the non-Greeks, but I understand you are Greek) should be learning from what the Greeks are and have been doing, because obviously, whatever it is works.

So in my view if they produce dense texts it’s probably a reflection of their own dense work and revolutionary organizing.

Elsewhere, maybe what the “general public” would be more receptive to is how we actually talk or communicate ideas to each other. I personally feel more invited into something when I join an ongoing conversation as opposed to when I’m being talked down to. And I also really appreciate their style of writing communiques.

]]> By: ReadBetweenTheLines http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-984 ReadBetweenTheLines Mon, 29 Dec 2008 03:55:43 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-984 The revolution -is- the message and the system proves the points by being repressive. Stand up and fight for your rights. It's the only way. The revolution -is- the message and the system proves the points by being repressive.

Stand up and fight for your rights. It’s the only way.

]]> By: prop http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-967 prop Sun, 28 Dec 2008 17:09:36 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-967 good points, medusa. good points, medusa.

]]> By: medusa http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-962 medusa Sun, 28 Dec 2008 07:32:14 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-962 Struggle is a school, I am not promoting an anti-intellectual movement. What I am saying is that the message has to reflect the audience. Therefore, when a group publishes declarations which seem to me clearly aimed at the public at large (not theoretical texts aimed at deepening our analysis in some way, shape or form) with the hope of mobilizing greater numbers of people to join, then the form of that text has to reflect that as well. In other words, there is a time and place for dense and complex analysis or exchange and a time and place for accessible statements that can actually be easily read and understood by all. I have seen nearly none of the latter in the last 2.5 weeks. This, I believe, is problematic and demonstrates an important failing in this movement's capacity to broaden itself. Clearly, in order for it to spread, there needs to be some serious thought about the way we choose to conveys our message can have a significant impact on doing so. Struggle is a school, I am not promoting an anti-intellectual movement. What I am saying is that the message has to reflect the audience. Therefore, when a group publishes declarations which seem to me clearly aimed at the public at large (not theoretical texts aimed at deepening our analysis in some way, shape or form) with the hope of mobilizing greater numbers of people to join, then the form of that text has to reflect that as well. In other words, there is a time and place for dense and complex analysis or exchange and a time and place for accessible statements that can actually be easily read and understood by all. I have seen nearly none of the latter in the last 2.5 weeks. This, I believe, is problematic and demonstrates an important failing in this movement’s capacity to broaden itself. Clearly, in order for it to spread, there needs to be some serious thought about the way we choose to conveys our message can have a significant impact on doing so.

]]> By: medusa http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-961 medusa Sun, 28 Dec 2008 07:21:45 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-961 Ego den sou milaw gia poihtika. Milaw gia to giati o kosmos den grafei sxedon katholo pragmata pio apla na mporei opios na'ne na ta katalavei. H epanastash den einai mono gia tous mathites sto panepistimio kai gia tous "intellectuals", einai gia olos o laos. Prepei loipon ta logia mas na einai pio apla kai na einai efkola na ta katalavoune oli. Pos alios na mporei opios na'ne na esthanete kalesmenos i kalesmenh sti kinisi?? Oti ayti i kinisi einai kai diki tous??? Ego den sou milaw gia poihtika. Milaw gia to giati o kosmos den grafei sxedon katholo pragmata pio apla na mporei opios na’ne na ta katalavei. H epanastash den einai mono gia tous mathites sto panepistimio kai gia tous “intellectuals”, einai gia olos o laos. Prepei loipon ta logia mas na einai pio apla kai na einai efkola na ta katalavoune oli. Pos alios na mporei opios na’ne na esthanete kalesmenos i kalesmenh sti kinisi?? Oti ayti i kinisi einai kai diki tous???

]]> By: Santeri Satama http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-950 Santeri Satama Sun, 28 Dec 2008 00:14:31 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-950 Yes, Greek language is dense. Every Greek is a fucking poet. 23. ΖΩ ΠΟΙΗΤΙΚΑ ΣΗΜΑΙΝΕΙ, ΑΝΑ ΠΑΣΑ ΣΤΙΓΜΗ ΔΗΜΙΟΥΡΓΩ ΚΑΙ ΚΑΤΑΣΤΡΕΦΩ ΚΟΣΜΟΥΣ – Η ΕΠΑΝΑΣΤΑΣΗ Ή ΘΑ ΕΙΝΑΙ ΠΟΙΗΤΙΚΗ, Ή ΔΕΝ ΘΑ ΕΙΝΑΙ ΚΑΘΟΛΟΥ 23. RUNONA ELÄMINEN TARKOITTAA ETTÄ JOKA HETKI LUO JA TUHOAA MAAILMOJA – ELLEI VALLANKUMOUS OLE RUNOUTTA EI OLE VALLANKUMOUSTA 23. LIVIN POETICALLY MEANS THAT EACH MOMENT I AM CREATING AND DESTROYING WORLDS - IF REVOLUTION IS NOT POETRY IT'S NOT REVOLUTION. Yes, Greek language is dense. Every Greek is a fucking poet.

23. ΖΩ ΠΟΙΗΤΙΚΑ ΣΗΜΑΙΝΕΙ, ΑΝΑ ΠΑΣΑ ΣΤΙΓΜΗ ΔΗΜΙΟΥΡΓΩ ΚΑΙ ΚΑΤΑΣΤΡΕΦΩ ΚΟΣΜΟΥΣ – Η ΕΠΑΝΑΣΤΑΣΗ Ή ΘΑ ΕΙΝΑΙ ΠΟΙΗΤΙΚΗ, Ή ΔΕΝ ΘΑ ΕΙΝΑΙ ΚΑΘΟΛΟΥ

23. RUNONA ELÄMINEN TARKOITTAA ETTÄ JOKA HETKI LUO JA TUHOAA MAAILMOJA – ELLEI VALLANKUMOUS OLE RUNOUTTA EI OLE VALLANKUMOUSTA

23. LIVIN POETICALLY MEANS THAT EACH MOMENT I AM CREATING AND DESTROYING WORLDS – IF REVOLUTION IS NOT POETRY IT’S NOT REVOLUTION.

]]> By: Struggle is a School http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-942 Struggle is a School Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:52:41 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-942 How to Organize an Insurrection http://www.crimethinc.com/blog/2008/12/25/how-to-organize-an-insurrection/ This is a pretty interesting interview with the Void network published by CrimethInk. I think we should celebrate all kinds of theorizing, discussion and debate at this time. The anti-intellectual strains in the anarchist movement can be, in my opinion, just as worrying!! How to Organize an Insurrection
http://www.crimethinc.com/blog/2008/12/25/how-to-organize-an-insurrection/

This is a pretty interesting interview with the Void network published by CrimethInk.

I think we should celebrate all kinds of theorizing, discussion and debate at this time.

The anti-intellectual strains in the anarchist movement can be, in my opinion, just as worrying!!

]]> By: medusa http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-941 medusa Sat, 27 Dec 2008 20:43:36 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-941 I've read the original texts in greek and they are just as obtuse as the english translations. And although you may be right about this text being intended for comrades, the same can be said of nearly all of the texts published for the general populace as well (plus, we're assuming that somehow comrades are somehow of a different breed than the general public and that they are all able to easily comprehend this form of writing which I believe is debatable); the fact is that they are just as dense and inaccessible as the the text above. No, rather I hold the (likely unpopular view) that there exists a rather elitist strain in the greek anarchist movement. That is my worry. As an anarchist of greek origin, this is upsetting to me on both a political and personal level. I’ve read the original texts in greek and they are just as obtuse as the english translations.

And although you may be right about this text being intended for comrades, the same can be said of nearly all of the texts published for the general populace as well (plus, we’re assuming that somehow comrades are somehow of a different breed than the general public and that they are all able to easily comprehend this form of writing which I believe is debatable); the fact is that they are just as dense and inaccessible as the the text above.

No, rather I hold the (likely unpopular view) that there exists a rather elitist strain in the greek anarchist movement. That is my worry. As an anarchist of greek origin, this is upsetting to me on both a political and personal level.

]]> By: Anarchist Solidarity http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/2008/12/26/barricade-and-history-notes-on-the-intensification-of-bourgeois-antagonism/comment-page-1/#comment-937 Anarchist Solidarity Sat, 27 Dec 2008 17:33:22 +0000 http://www.occupiedlondon.org/blog/?p=74#comment-937 Remember this is an english translation from greek. However this is a text which was circulated among comrades? Personally I think the communiques and texts are representative of a strong and long-lived anarchist movement in greece. All power to them if they can not only talk the talk but walk the fucking walk as well! Remember this is an english translation from greek. However this is a text which was circulated among comrades?

Personally I think the communiques and texts are representative of a strong and long-lived anarchist movement in greece.

All power to them if they can not only talk the talk but walk the fucking walk as well!

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